Hi all just wondering whether anyone has had a chook with Visceral gout. I have had at least 3 chooks with it and now have another one with it. The previous 3 died. Had an autopsy done on one dead chook to found out the reason why they were getting sick. I have now changed from river water to rain water and am checking it twice a day. They get fed morning and night and are allowed to roam the paddock for about 4 hours per day due to alternating pens of chooks. Haven't given any shell grit as I have heard lack of water and too much calcium can cause it. If any one knows of what to feed the sick chook or what I should feed the rest of my chooks it would be much appreciated. They get laying pellets and wheat along with scraps which are every second day. Thanks.
Post by organic girl on Dec 15, 2010 12:41:30 GMT 8
Hi Jaydon, where are you located??
I hadn't heard of it either but a quick google search gave some clues. Your feeding regime sounds fine so maybe it is their water intake that is the problem. I had some problems with dehydrated chooks recently and have since put an extra water container in their pen on the other side. I also now have a water container outside when they free range. This all means that they don't have to travel any real distance to have a drink, and they don't have to walk through a hot sunny area to get a drink on a hot day. Hope this helps.
Only other suggestion, is it possible the river water has a high salt level - ours does so we can't use it for anything. Good luck
HI Jaydon after reading a bit about it ,it look like its not to hard to control, this is just one bit I took from on line good luck Trev
The book "Diseases of Poultry" suggests as follows:
"Birds should be kept under sanitary conditions and given plenty of green food. When several birds develop the disease it is well to give the whole flock Epsom salts (1/2 to 1 teaspoon per bird) and to reduce the amount of meat scrap and increase the quantity of green food." (Important: Discuss with a holistic vet!)
Information on the website of the Tufts University website states as follows:
" Early stages of nutritionally induced gout have been reversed with probenecid (promotes uric acid excretion), and colchicine (anti-inflammatory) for up to 10 weeks, in association with a low protein diet. Treatment of either articular or visceral gout with allopurinol has only been able to partially halt the progression of the disease and does not reverse the condition."
Apple cider is another one to try if you want to stay organic
High protein levels are typically associated with visceral gout, but there is no evidence that healthy kidneys will be harmed by excessive dietary protein. However, pet birds are often exposed to a numerous toxins (such as preservatives / chemicals in commercial bird food or drinking water and toxins in the environment - please refer to: Toxins in your Home) as well as pathogens that can cause damage to their pets’ kidneys. At that point dietary protein levels can become a potential hazard.
and the last one Treatment Options:
Traditional Treatments include:
* An ample supply of clean / filtered water * Aloe Detox (for example: "Lily of the Desert Aloe Detoxifying Formula" - available over the following websites: http://www.vitacost.com; http://www.amazon.com; www.internatural.com/ingr/ingr199340.cfm or at better health food stores) has shown multiple benefits for gout sufferers - one way to get birds to drink it is to drip it on their favorite soft foods. Adding it to their water may stop from them drinking as they may not like the taste. The manufacturer reports that Aloe Detox needs to be refrigerated (obviously). After opening, it will keep for 7 to 9 months.
Fresh gel from the leaves are superior to Aloe Vera gel bought commercially. Bird owners will cut off a small section each day and feed that section to their pet birds. The plant is easy to grow in most areas. It needs, however, to be grown organically -- without the use of chemical fertilizers, pesticides or herbicides.
*NOTE: Even though Aloe Vera is helpful for many birds, some rare birds may have a reaction to Aloe Vera. Spray one of your fngers and touch your bird's foot. Leave for 24 hours and see if an reaction occurs
o How to Harvest Fresh Aloe Vera Gel - Tips on harvesting aloe vera
* Allopathic drugs such as Allupurinol can lower uric acids levels and have been used in birds with varied results.
I live near Boyanup and have the Preston river running past. I swapped to rain water about a month ago. I make sure I top up the water containers day and night. The chooks are let out each day to eat grass. I don't get to feed them much other green food but give them any scraps. I have trouble with my Gold laced Wyandottes. I also have silkies and Australorps but haven't had trouble with them. They have trouble walking. The last two ended up with their legs sticking out funny when they sat down. It looks like the chook doesn't have much strength in her legs. They have been around 6 to 8 months old. I was worried they had some infectious disease which is why I took them too the vet. She wasn't sure what was wrong but they did have a high temp. When one died it was sent to perth to have an autopsy and Viseral gout was the cause of it dying. I've always fed the chooks Laying pellets and wheat but have now changed to poultry mix. I have been worried about the river water as we are next to orchards near Donnybrook and wonder how much pesticide there is run off into the water. Thanks for your help. Will buy some epsom salts and apple cider vinegar and try and feed to sick chook. I have since rung the vet twice and asked if there was anything I could give them but never got a phone call back. May have to find somewhere to get water tested but I think our rain water should be fine as our tank has only been up for 3 years. Don't know if the chook will get better but fingers crossed it will. Thanks, Donna.
HI Donna your rain water should be just fine lucky you. We are on the national grid pipeline from Perth to Kalgoorlie, even on the bottom of the water bill it lets us know that the water they charge us for could be unsafe to drink and we should take all precautions before we drink the stuff and its not there fault luckily to date I have had no problem with my chooks at this time they are feasting on Zucchini from the garden along with all the other over supply I have and they love it they also get a verry high protein wheat along with my home made ration good luck Trev
Post by organic girl on Dec 20, 2010 13:43:48 GMT 8
thought i would restart this thread. I live quite close to you (Ferguson Valley) so we would have very similar weather conditions and temperatures. Now that you have described some of the symptoms I think I may have a similar problem. It is only with my polish hens. The first occurred on a very hot day recently, the poor thing was almost unconcious and unable to stand, her legs were out to the side and she looked very strange. I treated her for dehydration with some electrolytes, sprayed her with cold water and put her in front of the fan. She recovered quite quickly after the electrolytes.
Yesterday it happened to another polish hen, same symptoms, no strength in her legs but not as severe as the first. I treated her with the electrolytes again but wasn't sure she was going to make it. This morning she was perkier and is back to eating and drinking normally but is still a bit wobbly on her legs.
Below are two internet extracts:
The exact cause of visceral gout is not clear but it appears there are a variety of factors that might cause a predisposition. It is often associated with high levels of dietary protein and calcium, Vitamin D3 hypervitaminosis, insufficient levels of Vitamin A and even lack of sufficient water supply. Other factors such as toxins, viruses, bacteria, other infections or metabolic disorders and stressors can interfere with kidney function and precipitate a problem.
Articular gout is a rare but serious condition in which uric acid crystals build up in an animal's joints. In poultry, articular gout is most often caused by dehydration and too much protein in a bird's diet.
I have recently changed my feed to a higher protein one which could be a potential problem. The chooks drink rain water from the tank we use for the house so I presume it would be OK.
HI organic girl have you tried putting the electrolytes. in there drinking water for a few days over a hot time to see the difference. I have a sprinkler system in all my bird cages and in there yards, as soon as it starts to get hot I turn on the tap and cool the place down and to date I have not had a problem every now and again maybe twice a year I will put amino acids into there drinking water for a week just to give them a boost as I mix most of my own ration I like to think that its all in it but you never know if there missing something Trev
I would have a good luck at staminade I use to give this to my son I have no idea of it would work on the chooks it would be worth a look anyway it would be a lot less expensive than the vets stuff Trev
These chooks that have had gout do not seem to get better. I'm trying to look after this chook and hope it stays alive. It is happy to eat. it looks like it hurts her to walk. She puts one foot right in front of the other and appears to be drunk with the way she walks. I know my chooks haven't liked the heat either but I believe this has nothing to do with heat. I don't mind giving them rain water but we only have about 1 metre deep of water left in tank. Fingers crossed it will get better.
I've never had my river water checked for salt or anything else. The vet said maybe they don't like the taste of the water so therefore aren't drinking enough. Thought it would taste better than the bread soaked in apple cider vinegar i'm feeding the sick chook. She is happy to eat what I give her.
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